Posted by bp hound on March 22, 2001, 7:46 pm
I have been watching a heated discussion in another forum about what "Rendevouz" really means.To me Rendevouz means getting together with friends a few times a summer and camping out(some in canvas tents or teepees and some in nylon and aluminum).Everyone shooting sidelocks or Flinters,all using round balls.
Some dressed in period dress, some in blue jeans and t-shirts.To me Rendevouz means getting together with good friends and having good clean fun.What does Rendevous mean to you?
Posted by tc_blackdiamond on March 23, 2001, 5:49 am , in reply to "What does the term "Rendevouz" mean to you?"
I have to agree with you 100%. Nowdays, If I were going to a rendevous, I would expect many people shooting flinters, but certainly not all, I would expect all people would be shooting round balls and real black powder probably. Some people would really be dressed with the old times in period correct clothing while others would be sporting a t shirt and blue jeans. Like you said, some people would stay in a teepee, others just a modern canvas tent they bought in the store. But everyone would be having fun with friends.
Posted by Doug/VA. on March 23, 2001, 7:28 am , in reply to "Re: What does the term "
tc_blackdiamond, welcome to this message board. To me a "rendevouz" is a "get together" to have shoots, swap lies ect. But I think the inline guns should be included to. While the inline is not my "cup of tea", it is to several shooters.
A rondevouz is to have fun, and to leave anyone out is not fair, no matter what kind of muzzleloader they shoot. I understand the NMLRA has an inline shoot to. While this upcoming "Ronde" is not supported by the NMLRA or backed by them, I still think it should be run in a fair way- and it will be.
Posted by Coondog on March 27, 2001, 12:15 am , in reply to "Re: What does the term "Rendevouz" mean to you?"
RULES ARE RULES. Pre 1840 at most events, patch and ball. It's in black and white on every flier. I believe until rules are changed, inlines are out! When they, the rules, are changed, only a few would attend such an affair with the inline people. They have a right to start their own "rendezvous", with their rules, if that's what they want. If the NMLRA did support such events, fine, but those that rendezvous under current rules have a right to do that too.
Posted by Trapper Gene on March 23, 2001, 9:10 pm , in reply to "Re: What does the term "Rendevouz" mean to you?"
Around these parts all the "vous have always been an attempt to re-create the events of the fur trade era though many are in F&I or Rev war garb the main idea has been geared towards an earlier time in history there are both primitive and modern camp areas, these are seperated so those who want the primitve atmosphere can have it. Some wear modern clothes some don't. As for the guns these events have ALWAYS been meant for guns from another time period those folks who started the ball rolling many years ago did not set up events for modern type guns whether they load from the front or not, the whole blasted idea was to step back in time, modern ML guns would be as out of place at such an event as a tommy gun, or bazooka. you can squezze and tweek the facts and get these things into hunting seasons but in no way could any one justify their use in a good old BP "vous.
Posted by Doug/VA on March 24, 2001, 8:59 am , in reply to "Re: What does the term "Rendevouz" mean to you?"
Most have a primitive as well as a modern camping area. I fail to see why there couldn't be a place set up for a "modern" muzzleloader shoot. Why only go half-way? Besides what really tickles me is an inline with a scope shooting against a iron-sighted flintlock and the flinter wins. If the camp is divided, why can't the shoots also be done the same way? I don't like leaving anyone out who would like to be involved. Like I said in another message "the inline is not my cup of tea", but face it they are here to stay.
I know the primitive area should stay that way, and I know it is a sight to behold, but not all shooters have a tepi or tent which would pass as such. The same with shooters. Not all have a nice long rifle in flintlock either. Just my thoughts.
Posted by Trapper Gene on March 24, 2001, 12:29 pm , in reply to "Re: What does the term "Rendevouz" mean to you?"
Yes there are options for primitave camping or modern camping as not everyone has or even cares for the re-inactment aspect, but the one common thread that started it all and has run deeply throughout the years is the desire to shoot "old" type guns. whether dressed up in funny clothes or camping in a tin tee pee. the modern stuff is undoubtedly here to stay in the hunting seasons, but the fact of the matter is these are "johnny come lately" guns to the world of ml and are just modern type guns re-tooled to load from the front.
They slipped through an unlocked back door into our hunting seasons only because the traditional shooters who worked their butts of to loby for ml hunts did not see them comming and the game departments did not see what was to be a conflict developing when they opted to use very liberal wording in their game laws, but that is another story. bottom line is just because it is legal doesn't make it right. As to leaving some one out there are always events and activities that have certain standards and rules,if you can't run your Jeep 4x4 in a motorcycle cross country, are you being left out? if I can't take my 30/30 duck hunting at a duck club, am I being left out?
fact of the matter is..... nobody wants them at 'vous near as I can tell. But this may not be right either I saw a post on another forum the pointed out a fact that had escaped me even after years of enjoying the traditional aspect of the sport and no small amount of research in to the history of guns...It seems that hundreds of years ago the Chinese used bamboo as a cannon and stuck the fuse in the rear end... wahla....... the first in-line and because of this and other early types of in-line ignition the re-tooled 700's and other modern design guns that load from the front are TRADITIONAL! This cyber forum is something else, I am surprised that you didn't here me scream clear back there in Virginia when I read that one. I solved part of the cyber sluge problem by setting a pallet under my chair, this gives me a little clearence above the stuff as it floats by.
Posted by Big Jake on March 24, 2001, 3:40 pm , in reply to "Re: What does the term "Rendevouz" mean to you?"
As to leaving some one out there are always events and activities that have certain
standards and rules,if you can't run your Jeep 4x4 in a motorcycle cross country, are you being left
out? if I can't take my 30/30 duck hunting at a duck club, am I being left out?
You are absolutely right. If someone put together an in-line only shoot, I wouldn't expect them to include my sidelock flinter, and yet..............hey, shouldn't bp cartridge guns be included at an in-line bp event, it's just the next evolution aint it? And they are pretty much in-line ignition!
Posted by mamaflinter on March 24, 2001, 3:05 pm , in reply to "Re: What does the term "
Trapper I heard a noise shortly after that post you speak of. Just didn't know where it was coming from. Thanks for letting me know it was from you! LOL
Posted by bp hound on March 24, 2001, 5:33 am , in reply to "Re: What does the term "Rendevouz" mean to you?"
I gotta agree with Trapper Gene.An inline at a Rendevouz just wouldn't do!
Posted by Big Jake on March 23, 2001, 8:42 am , in reply to "Re: What does the term "Rendevouz" mean to you?"
A Rondezvous should be whatever the organizer wants it to be. However; in the strict sence of the word, it (modern rondezvous) was initially devised to accomodate those that used the old style guns, and along with it the old equipment, clothing ect. What you guys are talking about is a blackpowder shoot/get together. It is a fine idea. Call it what you want. It dont' matter, it is just a name. Call it a rondy, and have lax rules, that is fine. However, if someone wants to have a strictly primitive rondy, (which ofcourse the one in Kentucky was never intended to be), then their rules are their rules and should be respected as such. To show up at a rondy that is advertised as a primitive or a pre 1840 rules event with an in-line and jeans and expect to participate is wrong. It would be like me out in the battle line of a Civil War reenactment in shorts and a racing t-shirt. Most primitive rondys do have a visitors day or two, but it is not wrong for them to set and keep rules that keep it primitive only.
Posted by Doug/VA. on March 23, 2001, 3:43 pm , in reply to "Re: What does the term "
"It would be like me out in the battle line of a Civil War reenactment in shorts and a racing t-shirt."
Jake I know what you mean by that. I reenact and I can tell you on hot days it's not much fun, with all that wool on. Call the get together what ever you like. I'm going to have fun.
Posted by WCY on March 23, 2001, 2:05 pm , in reply to "Re: What does the term "Rendevouz" mean to you?"
I have observed over the four decades or so I have shot muzzle guns and attended numerous events for their use and display, a dichotomy between what now is called a RENDEZ' VOUS and what we once called a "shoot". The former often has much greater emphasis on reenactment or recreation of lifestyle and less emphasis on actually shooting for either fun or score, as the term "shoot" often connoted in my experience. Lodging modes are often strictly segregated as well obvious discrimination based on one's attire, i.e., period, or modern dress. While I often attended muzzleloading events some years ago before this obvious evolution of purpose became so rigid, now, I do it very infrequently, and always make pointed inquiry were the proposed event a rendez' vous or a shoot! Since my main interest has always lain with the firearms themselves and not with the apropos clothing,camp-fire irons, genre of lodges, etc, I seldom attend events other than those which a friend and I host on a range we made on his property, and our conclaves are dedicated prinicpally to shooting. Anyone wanting to dress in costume is surely so welcomed, but those wearing blue jeans, baseball caps, and sweatshirts denoting their favorite college team are just as welcomed!!
Posted by Powderburnt on March 23, 2001, 9:32 pm , in reply to "Re: What does the term "Rendevouz" mean to you?"
I have to agree with those that believe it should be whatever the people putting it on want it to be. If it's to be strictly pre 1840 then I feel they have the right to expect just that and most will say so in the flyers or adds. If in doubt, call ahead for particulars. Just my thoughts.