When firing 209 primers to dry out the breech my Savage ML10 II I've found they are hard to remove from the bolt face, a situation that doesn't occur when a charge is fired. An examination of the stickey primers found the primer proper had backed out of its cup. This jams the flange of the primer cup against the retaining slot in the bolt face.
Any who've tried to shoot plastic, wax, or rubber bullets from a revolver using a primer for motive force have experienced a similar occurence if you did not drill out the case's flash hole. When fired the primer sets back against the recoil plate, but because of the lack of pressure the case does not. This locks up the action in good shape
14299: Savage ML 10 II and Sticking Primers
10/16/01-8:49 AM Posted by: 1SHOT-1KILL
I have the same thing happen to all my 10ML-II's. When you fire just a primer, there is no back pressure to keep the primer flat, this causes the primer cup to back out when just the primer is fired. I take my ball starter and with a couple light taps it usaully comes right out. Just one of those minor inconvient things I've learned to live with.
The Federal 209A is the primer which sticks more than any other one. It is also the hottest.
Posted by: Huntaholic - 12/9/2001 (8:03 p.m.) - 22.214.171.124
I have also noticed an odd primer problem. I am shooting winchester 209 primers and EVERY TIME I fire a primer through an empty chamber to clear the vent liner and dry out all oil from cleaning,
I have to use pliers to remove the spent primer. When the gun is loaded and fired they are only hard to remove about 1 time out of 3. Anybody got any ideas as to why this happens? if it was the other way around, I would say that pressure is too excessive, but removal is most difficult with an empty gun!
Posted by: st22 - 12/9/2001 (8:22 p.m.) - 126.96.36.199
I had the same problem on my first 3-5 shots, the primers were hard to remove but now they aren't, I think I read in the troubleshooting part of the manual that it is due to low pressure, which would make sense if it is happening when you just shoot a primer to clear the vent liner.
Posted by: Doug/VA - 12/9/2001 (8:35 p.m.) - 188.8.131.52
Yes it would seem that the primer would be more difficult to remove when the gun was fired instead of just the primer. But what happens is the pressure (what gets back to the primer) in a way reforms it so that it comes out easy.
I also had a problem with stuck primers in the bolt face at first, but what ever caused the problem is going away. I also noticed that with light loads they are more difficult to remove. You can snap the gun again on a stuck primer and this helps.
But to be on the safe side I'm going to carry my multi-tool while hunting
Posted by: Doug/VA - 12/9/2001 (3:06 p.m.) - 184.108.40.206
While fooling around with my Savage today I noticed that between Winchester, Federal, and CCI, there is a difference in the size. The Federal, and Winchester's will go into the breechplug "chamber" rather easily. But the CCI's are really tight fitting, so tight in fact when I closed the bolt I had to force it to close. When I opened the bolt to extract the primer (without firing it) I had to pull on the bolt to get it out of the breechplug. This is CCI mag primers.
Posted by: Doug/VA - 12/16/2001 (2:02 p.m.) - 220.127.116.11
I've shot CCI Mags, standard Winchester 209s, & Federal 209As in my Savage. When shooting the rifle with the CCIs & Winchesters, upon opening the bolt, I can turn the rifle 45 degrees, and the primer will fall out. With the Federals, I have to snap it a second time, then pry it out with my fingers. Sometimes I have to use pliers to get the primer out. Figures this primer WOULD HAVE to be the one that shoots the best so far in the rifle.
What has been YOUR experience with using the different primers in your rifle?
Posted by: TC - 12/16/2001 (6:33 p.m.) - 18.104.22.168
I haven't shot anything but Feds in my gun and my results have been the same, most of them require a second smack from the pin to let them come out by hand. Out of my first 12 shots, 2 of the primers wouldn't even allow the bolt to lock up. I was curious as to whether you guys have had that happen with the Feds or any other brands. By the way, when the bolt wouldn't lock, I did pull the bolt and check the breech plug to make sure it was tight, it was.
Posted by: Doug/Va - 12/16/2001 (6:43 p.m.) - 22.214.171.124
TC, the CCI's are a pressed fit when you close the bolt-no blow back (no black on the sides of the spent primer body). The bolt is a bit hard to close for the last bit of the way down. But when you fire the gun and open the bolt, all you have to do is tilt the gun sideways and the primer will fall out of the bolt face. The Winchester primers go in easy, and they also will fall out of the bolt face when the gun is shot.
I have looked at all three primers, and can't see that much difference between them. Why the Federal primers insist on sticking in the bolt face is a mystery to me.
Posted by: 1SHOT-1KILL - 12/16/2001 (7:15 p.m.) - 126.96.36.199
It may be that the Federal primers have a brass carrier surrounding the actual primer. CCI & Winchester have what appear to be aluminum. The brass may flow a little more or set a little more due to being softer. Only thing that I can think of at the moment.
Posted by: TC - 12/16/2001 (7:14 p.m.) - 188.8.131.52
Hmmm, Thanks Doug. I went with the Feds because I read that they were the hottest of all the primers, I'm sure any of them will work though. I think I'd much prefer ease of removal over a little extra heat. TC
Posted by: Doug/VA - 12/17/2001 (6:46 a.m.) - 184.108.40.206
TC, I would stay with a "mag" primer. I have had good luck with the CCI mags, and they don't stick in the bolt face.